Theoretical biologist here. I’m going to push back on that just a bit. I think that you might have mentioned Selfish Gene, too. That was not the best book even at the time of publication (most biologists had a number of problems with it oversimplifying in a way that’s probably similar to what anthropologists think about Guns Germs and Steel). It also has been getting worse the more we learn.
Evolution acts on the phenotype, not the genotype. It affects the gene makeup of the population through differential reproduction rates. “Fitness” can be measured as a value relative to the rest of the population specifically by using the number of offspring. So what I’m saying here is that all factors that affect phenotype, whether genes or other factors, affect evolution.
So, of course genes are important. But you have epigenetic factors, too. link here You also have extensive non-coding regions that regulate transcription. You have rna editing. And so on.
If you’re interested, I would highly recommend a book called How Life Works by Phillip Ball. It was just published in November and is an outstanding summary of how much our understanding of life has evolved (heh) in the last 20 years or so.
Well, you would know a lot better. And thanks for the reading recommendation.
What are your thoughts on viruses as a form of life? Asking what natural selection is in exact terms is pretty closely related to asking what life is, since life is probably some subset of things that can do natural selection.
Personally, I do think of viruses as a form of life, and although it’s not universally held by any means, I think there’s a growing consensus around the idea.
That’s probably as minimalistic as I would go, though. I mean, you can make a similar argument to some extent about prions, but prions are too close to being “just chemistry” for me.
Viruses on the other hand cooperate and compete in complex ecosystems, which in my opinion magnifies the complexity of a virus as an element of a complex adaptive system. They don’t have a metabolism as such (which is why so many don’t consider them living), but their ability to conduct theft of resources of more complex and obviously living systems makes me push them to group of living things.
One of the nearest things about biology is that there’s always an exception to the rules and examples, and the simplifications we make when teaching bio 101 are really best learned as rules of thumb. Things like what a “gene” really is, the operation of selection, and even what constitutes a “species” can lead to some really interesting discussions.
A few fields are a bit like that. I remember my chemistry teacher in high school saying something similar.
As mostly a math person, it kind of bugs me. There definitely is one set of rules that a field obeys, and while it’s usually necessary to simplify I’d really like to know how not to. Sure, water is mostly incompressible, but it’s not exactly so, and that’s how sound works and can translate to other mediums. And then once you get down to small scales, high energies or low pressures you start seeing the individual water molecules being relevant and doing all kinds of different things. Those factors were always there, even if they weren’t relevant.
Sorry, maybe that’s a bit of a rant, but all that to say I’m sure you can find a consensus on these questions eventually.
Theoretical biologist here. I’m going to push back on that just a bit. I think that you might have mentioned Selfish Gene, too. That was not the best book even at the time of publication (most biologists had a number of problems with it oversimplifying in a way that’s probably similar to what anthropologists think about Guns Germs and Steel). It also has been getting worse the more we learn.
Evolution acts on the phenotype, not the genotype. It affects the gene makeup of the population through differential reproduction rates. “Fitness” can be measured as a value relative to the rest of the population specifically by using the number of offspring. So what I’m saying here is that all factors that affect phenotype, whether genes or other factors, affect evolution.
So, of course genes are important. But you have epigenetic factors, too. link here You also have extensive non-coding regions that regulate transcription. You have rna editing. And so on.
If you’re interested, I would highly recommend a book called How Life Works by Phillip Ball. It was just published in November and is an outstanding summary of how much our understanding of life has evolved (heh) in the last 20 years or so.
Well, you would know a lot better. And thanks for the reading recommendation.
What are your thoughts on viruses as a form of life? Asking what natural selection is in exact terms is pretty closely related to asking what life is, since life is probably some subset of things that can do natural selection.
Personally, I do think of viruses as a form of life, and although it’s not universally held by any means, I think there’s a growing consensus around the idea.
That’s probably as minimalistic as I would go, though. I mean, you can make a similar argument to some extent about prions, but prions are too close to being “just chemistry” for me.
Viruses on the other hand cooperate and compete in complex ecosystems, which in my opinion magnifies the complexity of a virus as an element of a complex adaptive system. They don’t have a metabolism as such (which is why so many don’t consider them living), but their ability to conduct theft of resources of more complex and obviously living systems makes me push them to group of living things.
One of the nearest things about biology is that there’s always an exception to the rules and examples, and the simplifications we make when teaching bio 101 are really best learned as rules of thumb. Things like what a “gene” really is, the operation of selection, and even what constitutes a “species” can lead to some really interesting discussions.
A few fields are a bit like that. I remember my chemistry teacher in high school saying something similar.
As mostly a math person, it kind of bugs me. There definitely is one set of rules that a field obeys, and while it’s usually necessary to simplify I’d really like to know how not to. Sure, water is mostly incompressible, but it’s not exactly so, and that’s how sound works and can translate to other mediums. And then once you get down to small scales, high energies or low pressures you start seeing the individual water molecules being relevant and doing all kinds of different things. Those factors were always there, even if they weren’t relevant.
Sorry, maybe that’s a bit of a rant, but all that to say I’m sure you can find a consensus on these questions eventually.