Andy Yen’s values are incompatible with Proton’s mission. He advocates for poor security practices, supports fascists, and he verbally abuses his subordinates. As such, I can no longer in good conscience continue to financially support a company with such terrible leadership.
Unfortunately for me, my subscription just renewed last month on a multi year plan, but it does give me time to browse for and experiment with alternatives.
If you’re able, I encourage you to do the same and cite Andy Yen as the driving factor for your decision. We can’t let these tech bro fascists destroy what little semblance of privacy we have left.
where do you migrate to? especially password manager and web storage?
I used to self host those, but nextcloud is a pain to keep updated, and password management is to important to do half assed.
edit: thanks for the suggestions. i’m gonna try out filen, and after that maybe keypass via filen
I said this before, will say it again: do not migrate to another subscription service.
People went through all the trouble to migrate from Google to Proton, then now they must migrate from Proton to whatever else, and the cycle will repeat again.
Subscription services, cloud software, they all strip you of agency and control. You don’t have direct access to the files, you don’t control the GUI, they are filled with proprietary formats, you are at their hands if they decide to change something you like, or pricing, or if they simply go nuts.
Keep your things in your computer. Need they synced? SyncThing will do that for you on any device imaginable.
Totally disagree. Self hosting a mail server is a world of pain, and not all subscription services are equal.
If you’re a masochist try self-hosting your own email service. Otherwise, shop around and find a service that is compatible with your threat model.
Nah let them find out. Leave proton and host their own mail server
I give it a month max
Hosting your own email is actually not that hard. It takes a fair amount of initial setup but if you do it right, it is very stable and functional. Email servers are very mature, and things like Postfix hardly need anything once set up. Getting a static IP is the hard part, but if you run it on a VPS with a good IP you can just hang onto it.
Filtering traffic via (e.g.) pfblocker feeds and spamassassin kills most spam, and it is awesome to just create and destroy your own mailboxes at will.
the problem is that your outgoing mail will be rejected every now end then. and its a major hassle to get unblocked, if you end up on some blocklist accidentally, which will happen occasionally over the years, even with no fault of your own.
Sure, that might be true for email, but definitely not for the rest of the list that you conveniently ignored
On top of that, while shopping around dont look for one service doing it all
There is absolutely 0 reason for my email provider to also handle my passwords and photos, but many reasons the opposite way
I wasn’t ignoring anything or suggesting people should put all their eggs in one basket. Doing that would be ridiculous. Im assuming people would have the common sense not to do that.
The vast majority of people don’t know the difference between 2FA and passkeys, and you want them to manage their own self hosted solutions for everything? Yeah, keep repeating this I guess…
You might as well move out to the mountains and live off grid and pretend like that’s a real solution.
they replied to me, where i said “I used to self host those”, so it’s fair they suggested to selfhost some other service
That’s fair enough, I paid more attention to the “I keep saying this” part.
I didn’t mention self hosting nor do I think it’s necessary, unless you consider any service running in your desktop as “self hosting”.
People need/want/are used to active sync. For that one either needs a true self-hosted solution and/or a service that requires opening port(s) on the firewall/router, which most people either have no idea how to do or can’t due to ISP lockdown. Self-hosting can very quickly turn into a 2nd job and not everyone wants that. Or they have no required techical knowledge and no desire or time to learn. Plus, you still have to set up proper backups, even if the service is just running on your desktop. Unless, of course, you’re fine with a single point of failure.
On the topic of mail hosting, as someone who works in IT and self-hosts a whole stack of things: I do not ever want to self-host my email. Personally, I was considering just getting another domain for email and switching backend services as needed, but I liked the package Proton offered, so I chose that instead. I might need to rethink that domain option, but at this rate, soon no backend service will be safe from fascists and/or AI.
It is if you want to access it from anywhere on any device. I know SyncThing makes that a lot easier, but not exactly a set and forget kind of thing.
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You need subscriptions when you are getting an actual service. Cloud storage isn’t cheap, it will always cost something and offer unique redundancy you can’t get storing everything at home.
Things like cloud storage, VPNs and VPSs will always cost something.
That said you don’t necessarily need any of those.
yes. at least desktop <-> notebook <-> phone. Also I want friends to send me files and vice versa.
I tried that when before i migrated from selfhosted nextcloud to proton. it was pretty annoying to keep running. And I couldnt easily use it to send files to friends. That was some years ago though. maybe things changed idk.
Will SyncThing sync photos from an iPhone to a Linux desktop?
Yes, with Möbius Sync. You’ll have to copy the photos on the iPhone to a directory where Files can see them because of a security thing on Apple’s side, then connect Möbius to the Linux desktop running syncthing, and point Möbius to the photos location in Files to make the share.
That advice is not helpful, though. Most of us used to store passwords on our computer: In our internet browsers. In plain text for anyone to grab. It was the dumbest idea ever and password managers became popular quickly in recent years as more people realized they need to protect their credentials somehow. So no, I genuinely do not believe in just storing passwords somewhere without any safety measures.
Depends on what you’re trying to defend against. If it’s against a burglar, full disk encryption is plenty, and you can go ahead and save those passwords in the browser and it doesn’t matter at all. If it’s against your own government you’re probably screwed no matter what you do, just a matter of how long it takes them to notice you. Eventually you’ll get tired of being in jail and will cough up what they want to know.
I’d definitely use some way of encryption and never store anything in a browser. Nearly nobody does keylogging anymore. Trojans just get your emails and passwords from the browser files and bounce. And you can never be sure if someone might sneak something in. Not as a regular user. Maybe one of the mods in that Minecraft modpack you play with friends suddenly has something in it and you won’t know until notifications are rolling in about attempts to log into your accounts. So I definitely would never save passwords in a browser in 2026. Now, I know there are looooots of password managers out there but you need one that can be trusted.
So yeah I want a handy tool that can quickly fill in my credentials but encrypts everything just well enough to protect me from automated kind of attacks and maybe a burglar too just to be sure. Lots to choose from but I loathe doing all the research to get something that is actually safe, user friendly, reliable and works on Arch. Everything comes with it’s up and downs.
See? You’re almost helpful. But I do have to ask you if that password manager has a name? You see, at this point most people would’ve already given up or just ask ChatGPT or Google AI about it, which in this case would be hypocrite but I digress.
Sure, had you asked about a solution rather than trying to write some sort of gotcha. KeePassXC is a fully complete password manager, better than whatever subscription crap you’d rather push, and it stores everything into an encrypted local db file you control. Now guess what I’d recommend for syncing that file across other devices.
Okay now you have to give me a source on that too.
Do you understand a source is? How can one provide a source to a subjective statement with a comparison that doesn’t name a particular service? Provide me a source that my favorite dish is yakisoba.
I was just calling out your antagonism because making wild assumptions about me is pretty wild. Sorry if I’m being perceived as help vampire for asking for directions. Please, if you only wish to give information with a side dish of hostility then you can keep your secrets.
Yeah, as for Windscribe and Tuta…
https://retro.social/@ifixcoinops/117526586958025535
https://mastodon.social/@Tutanota/117518311002072172
I was considering Windscribe, but Canada’s new Bill C-22 is making me reconsider.
https://windscribe.com/features/no-identifying-logs
Do you think the bill would bypass the no-logs privacy protections?
Thanks. I am gonna try out filen.
then ill try keypassxc with sync via filen. (Bitwarden seems to go a little downhill recently)
KeePassXC on desktop, KeePassDX on a phone. The KDBX files are encrypted, and unless you store other files inside of there, they are also pretty tiny (<1MB), so you can put it anywhere. Of course, in that case, don’t store cloud login details in that password database.
I was considering moving to it but was unsure if KeePassDX was as reliable for the phone. Kinda annoys me how many different apps there are and why KeePassXC doesn’t support one within.
I dont want to use Valutwarden and be dependent on Bitwarden in any way. Private equity will always enshitify and I’m not gonna wait to find out.
can i sync pw between desktop and phone automatically?
I’ve heard someone using syncthing for that, but I haven’t used it. I prefer everything to stay manual.
I use Syncthing for KeePass and Obsidian across Linux boxes and iOS. Works beautifully.
I don’t know yet, but I got 600+ days to figure it out 😬
For webstorage Ive been using Tresorit. It belongs to the Swiss Post. I expect some solid neutrality from the company at least.
Apps and cli tools work well enough.
Self hosting vaultwarden is pretty easy, standalone, and lightweight. It doesn’t need anything like next cloud and has an alpine container option
If your server is down you just can’t save new passwords but the local copy on your phone or computer is still up
Vaultwarden.