• sugartits@lemmy.world
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    2 months ago

    What has encryption got to do with it?

    Most of telegram is not encrypted. There are unencrypted channels on telegram right now hosting child pornography. Telegram never removes them.

    • Todd Bonzalez@lemm.ee
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      2 months ago

      Telegram and VK are both CSAM cesspits. Most of Russian social media has this problem, but VK and Telegram are where you’ll end up exposed to shit just by browsing.

    • HelixDab2@lemm.ee
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      2 months ago

      Good. They shouldn’t.

      Unencrypted channels are the ones that are easiest to trace, and the easiest ones to successfully base a prosecution on.

      The most correct response is to report them to law enforcement. Unencrypted channels make amazingly effective honeypots. It’s fairly easy to bust people using unencrypted channels, esp. because people think they’re anonymous and safe. It’s much, much harder to bust people once they move to .onion sites and the real dark net away from their phone. When you shut down all the easy channels, you push people into areas where it’s much harder, almost impossible, to root them out.

      • Todd Bonzalez@lemm.ee
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        2 months ago

        Look, if you’re going to knowingly host child porn, and not take it down even after you have been made aware, you get what’s coming to you.

        The idea that Telegram would somehow better serve their customers by staging law enforcement stings in unencrypted channels is completely divorced from Telegram’s core mission.

        This has nothing to do with freedom of speech or the right to encrypt. Child Pornography is a criminal matter. Failure to cooperate with law enforcement while providing comms and distribution to child pornographers is going to land you in deep shit eventually.

      • whereisk@lemmy.world
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        2 months ago

        What if telegram refuses to cooperate with law enforcement in a timely fashion to provide details of the people sharing that material? What should law enforcement do then?

        • prettybunnys@sh.itjust.works
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          2 months ago

          At that point they’re willingly hosting it for no reason other than to host it for their customers and they’re complicit, no?

        • HelixDab2@lemm.ee
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          2 months ago

          I think that holding the executives and BoD in criminal contempt of court is a good place to start.

          EDIT: AFAIK Telegram doesn’t use warrant canaries.

      • flying_sheep@lemmy.ml
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        2 months ago

        No. You can say that about so many laws being made, but telegram simply hosts the most vile shit.

        • ravhall@discuss.online
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          2 months ago

          So you’re saying we should shut down any service that allows encrypted communication? Because any service that offers encrypted communication is going to be enticing to someone who commits crimes.

          • Todd Bonzalez@lemm.ee
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            2 months ago

            No, we should shut down any service that refuses to take action against its users when presented with proof that they are distributing child porn.

            Encryption only offers so much plausible deniability. Once law enforcement gains access to one of these channels, they have proof of what’s going on, and the content is all hosted by Telegram. When Telegram refuses to cooperate and remove this content, they become complicit in distributing it.

            Encryption isn’t an excuse to violate the law. If Telegram’s policy is not to remove CSAM, then they are a criminal organization.

            • ravhall@discuss.online
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              2 months ago

              We should shut down any organization that doesn’t cooperate with police when people are breaking laws or just the laws you want them to help enforce?

              • flying_sheep@lemmy.ml
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                2 months ago

                No, that’s not what the person is saying in the slightest. Just read their comment again, it’s actually very clear.

                • ravhall@discuss.online
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                  2 months ago

                  Creating a Telegram Channel to help underage victims of rape in Idaho get abortions out of state without their parent’s consent is also a crime. Would you want to shut them down for allowing those groups?

                  If Telegram is indeed knowledgeable of specific groups distributing CSAM, goes into that group and views the material to confirm, and still does nothing about it, then yes… that’s pretty terrible. However, it’s law enforcement’s responsibility to find those people and arrest them. If Telegram is shut down, there will always be another method. TOR, popup forums, file sharing sites like MEGA.

                  What I’m saying is focusing on the communication method is like trying to kill a hydra.

                  • flying_sheep@lemmy.ml
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                    2 months ago

                    Again: not what the person said. They said that if someone proves that you host CSAM, you should take it down.