An ICE operation spiraled into chaos in Worcester, Massachusetts street after agents detained a woman as she clung to her baby—without showing a warrant.
“We don’t have to show you anything,” one agent reportedly shot back when asked for ID or a warrant.
Actually, yea. You do. Or its just assault and kidnapping. Official paperwork is not privileged or secret. That idiot should be fired along with his chain of command.
Yes. Will the court decide in your favor? Who knows, but I’d wager probably not. It’s better to try it and find out then let this happen though, or probably a better idea would be to get out ASAP and try to become a ghost if possible. Eventually this won’t be tolerated, but people need to see others stand up before they will usually.
Just because Marmalade Mussolini or his DOJ wrote a memo doesn’t make it legal. The use of the Alien Enemies Act is already highly contested in federal court. (It remains to be seen if/when courts will enforce their rulings, but just today a Tufts University student was released from ICE custody as a result of a judge’s ruling.)
No. They do no matter what. Once they tread on the Fourth the grumblings about resistance, rebellion, or revolt become a legal defense of our Constitutional rights. These people immediately get “promoted” and become a demest8c threat to the Constitution. It would then become open hunting season on ICE, with defending the Constitution becoming the legal defense.
The only reason it hasn’t happened yet is because ICE is targeting weak willed areas. They are moving fast and they also happen to be getting a large percentage of illegals with only occasional “mistakes”.
There’s a court case right now. He’s suing the ability of federal judges to make essentially precedence matter.
If he wins this case in the Supreme Court, All executive orders are law until they are challenged in court, and if one person wins a judgment, It will have zero effect on other like cases.
So the playbook is he writes an executive order that ice doesn’t need to show warrants, ice doesn’t show warrant, each individual that is f***** over by this executive order has to take it to court individually, assuming they’re not already in a South American prison.
We’re a couple of judgments away from absolute dictatorship.
It’s also reported that Trump’s people are working on suspending habeas corpus. This would remove your right to challenge your arbitrary imprisonment in court. So they will be able to disappear anyone, forever, with no reason and no legal recourse. Effectively Trump will then be an absolute dictator.
Habeas corpus (/ˈheɪbiəs ˈkɔːrpəs/ ⓘ; from Medieval Latin, lit. ‘you should have the body’) is a legal procedure by which a report can be made to a court alleging the unlawful detention or imprisonment of an individual, and requesting that the court order the individual’s custodian (usually a prison official) to bring the prisoner to court, to determine whether their detention is lawful. Relief, when available, is generally governed by equitable principles.
One of the few criticisms of Lincoln is that he suspended Habeas Corpus during the Civil War. I expect that the MAGA Nazis will be invoking Lincoln’s name in this regard. They love to claim that they are the “Party of Lincoln,” and therefore he would support their treason.
If nothing physically stops them from doing what they say they can do, then they can do it, and the constitution is meaningless. This is what is happening, they are proving the constitution is meaningless.
The Constitution is essentially enforced by the Honor System, which is easily ignored by people who not only have no honor, but consider it a weakness that should be ruthlessly exploited. A petson with ethics and integrity can be easily bested by someone who ddoesn’t respect those qualities.
Eventually ICE will stumble upon someone with a strong interest in the Second Amendment and get themselves physically stopped. Because ICE’s actions are unconstitutional they will be considered illegal, thus whatever is done to stop them will be legal.
It is only a matter of time and this story will be in the news.
MAGA thinks they can tread upon the Constitution, but the Constitution lays coiled and has sharp fangs.
The Constitution only has meaning because you all say it has meaning. All of its enforcement comes down to the Executive branch. Congress doesn’t have enforcers, the Judiciary doesn’t have enforcers. Systematically, all of the people in the Executive branch that would stop this are being forced out. The people in power have decided the Constitution has no meaning, and it’s too late to stop them. Killing some ICE agents is what they want so they have the justification to declare martial law and subjugate the entire country by force.
They probably do want to push the populace over the edge using ICE. However, that is an error in judgement. The mistake they are making is assuming many people are not already over the edge.
They are looking and hoping for the people that will go batshit crazy and run out into the streets screaming “Rebellion! Riot!”. These are not the people they are getting. My educated guess assumption in theory is that MAGA has created a great deal of dusgruntled legal gun owners patiently waiting for a situation that presents an opportunity.
ICE has already fucked around and found out several times.
Several ICE agents have already been shot in Mexico city.
Remember, if ICE doesn’t have a warrant to come on your property then you can tresspass them. If they do not leave after you tresspass then they become armed criminal assailants.
In some states (like mine) your car is your castle/home. Pull someone over without just cause in my state and it becomes a game of mobile fuck around and find out.
I’m curious. Do they have toshow it to bystanders? To the person they are arresting sure. And I would think to family of that person… but maybe not. I doubt they have to show it to randos on the street. But, I think it is safe to assume they didn’t have it. Even if they did, thier history means they have blown any credibility on that front.
As for ID. I do wonder about that. Anyone know the actual laws?
“We don’t have to show you anything,” one agent reportedly shot back when asked for ID or a warrant.
Actually, yea. You do. Or its just assault and kidnapping. Official paperwork is not privileged or secret. That idiot should be fired along with his chain of command.
Fired? This guy will be promoted. Shake your head. Fight back.
Am I allowed to shoot in self defense if this happens in a stand your ground state?
Yes. Will the court decide in your favor? Who knows, but I’d wager probably not. It’s better to try it and find out then let this happen though, or probably a better idea would be to get out ASAP and try to become a ghost if possible. Eventually this won’t be tolerated, but people need to see others stand up before they will usually.
Helpful neighbor: “No, I’m with ICE and I’m arresting you motherfuckers.”
*We all get to pretend to be ICE or whatever the fuck if there’s no requirement to prove who you are
Actually no. https://newrepublic.com/post/194442/trump-doj-memo-ice-arrest-search-warrant
Civil liberties have already been suspended
Just because Marmalade Mussolini or his DOJ wrote a memo doesn’t make it legal. The use of the Alien Enemies Act is already highly contested in federal court. (It remains to be seen if/when courts will enforce their rulings, but just today a Tufts University student was released from ICE custody as a result of a judge’s ruling.)
For now.
No. They do no matter what. Once they tread on the Fourth the grumblings about resistance, rebellion, or revolt become a legal defense of our Constitutional rights. These people immediately get “promoted” and become a demest8c threat to the Constitution. It would then become open hunting season on ICE, with defending the Constitution becoming the legal defense. The only reason it hasn’t happened yet is because ICE is targeting weak willed areas. They are moving fast and they also happen to be getting a large percentage of illegals with only occasional “mistakes”.
We don’t know if they’re actually getting any “illegals”
There’s a court case right now. He’s suing the ability of federal judges to make essentially precedence matter.
If he wins this case in the Supreme Court, All executive orders are law until they are challenged in court, and if one person wins a judgment, It will have zero effect on other like cases.
So the playbook is he writes an executive order that ice doesn’t need to show warrants, ice doesn’t show warrant, each individual that is f***** over by this executive order has to take it to court individually, assuming they’re not already in a South American prison.
We’re a couple of judgments away from absolute dictatorship.
It’s also reported that Trump’s people are working on suspending habeas corpus. This would remove your right to challenge your arbitrary imprisonment in court. So they will be able to disappear anyone, forever, with no reason and no legal recourse. Effectively Trump will then be an absolute dictator.
https://www.pbs.org/newshour/politics/watch-stephen-miller-says-trump-administration-is-actively-looking-at-suspending-habeas-corpus
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Habeas_corpus
One of the few criticisms of Lincoln is that he suspended Habeas Corpus during the Civil War. I expect that the MAGA Nazis will be invoking Lincoln’s name in this regard. They love to claim that they are the “Party of Lincoln,” and therefore he would support their treason.
They can make whatever laws they want. This is a constitutional matter. It can only be changed by a 2/3s majority vote of the house and senate.
ICE can say they don’t need a warrant. Fuck them up if they don’t have one … a warrant is required.
The president can say ICE doesnt need a warrant … fuck him, he doesn’t have the authority … they do.
The Supreme Court can say ICE doesnt need a warrant … fuck them, they do not have the authority … a warrant is still needed.
Source: The Constitution
If nothing physically stops them from doing what they say they can do, then they can do it, and the constitution is meaningless. This is what is happening, they are proving the constitution is meaningless.
The Constitution is essentially enforced by the Honor System, which is easily ignored by people who not only have no honor, but consider it a weakness that should be ruthlessly exploited. A petson with ethics and integrity can be easily bested by someone who ddoesn’t respect those qualities.
Eventually ICE will stumble upon someone with a strong interest in the Second Amendment and get themselves physically stopped. Because ICE’s actions are unconstitutional they will be considered illegal, thus whatever is done to stop them will be legal.
It is only a matter of time and this story will be in the news. MAGA thinks they can tread upon the Constitution, but the Constitution lays coiled and has sharp fangs.
The Constitution only has meaning because you all say it has meaning. All of its enforcement comes down to the Executive branch. Congress doesn’t have enforcers, the Judiciary doesn’t have enforcers. Systematically, all of the people in the Executive branch that would stop this are being forced out. The people in power have decided the Constitution has no meaning, and it’s too late to stop them. Killing some ICE agents is what they want so they have the justification to declare martial law and subjugate the entire country by force.
They probably do want to push the populace over the edge using ICE. However, that is an error in judgement. The mistake they are making is assuming many people are not already over the edge.
They are looking and hoping for the people that will go batshit crazy and run out into the streets screaming “Rebellion! Riot!”. These are not the people they are getting. My educated guess assumption in theory is that MAGA has created a great deal of dusgruntled legal gun owners patiently waiting for a situation that presents an opportunity.
I applaud your optimism. But anyone resisting ICE with armed force will be killed by a SWAT team and immediately branded a terrorist by all the media.
Incorrect.
ICE has already fucked around and found out several times.
Several ICE agents have already been shot in Mexico city.
Remember, if ICE doesn’t have a warrant to come on your property then you can tresspass them. If they do not leave after you tresspass then they become armed criminal assailants.
In some states (like mine) your car is your castle/home. Pull someone over without just cause in my state and it becomes a game of mobile fuck around and find out.
I’m curious. Do they have toshow it to bystanders? To the person they are arresting sure. And I would think to family of that person… but maybe not. I doubt they have to show it to randos on the street. But, I think it is safe to assume they didn’t have it. Even if they did, thier history means they have blown any credibility on that front. As for ID. I do wonder about that. Anyone know the actual laws?
If they are expecting you to follow some sort of directive they do.