Looks like my account was banned/restricted for the above interaction, have already sent the mods on world an email asking if they’d be willing to reverse that. Had an episode of psychosis a few months ago where I did say some offensive stuff, (understandably) got a 3 month ban on .lol for that, so could see my account having been flagged.
I uh, I don’t think it’s reasonable to expect people to check others profiles to ensure we are correctly pronouning them… when making a throw away comment that is less than 10 words involving a ludicrously common saying. Jerboa does not show users pronouns. I could switch to an app that DOES show the pronouns, do any Lemmings have a recommendation for a free Lemmy mobile app that has that feature?
Edit: Edie chimed in, Jerboa does show pronouns. It’s a formatting issue with mobile vs browser (She has them on individual text lines so they don’t appear on mobile).
Was just going to respond to the user in question to let them know I wasn’t purposefully trying to offend that individual, to discover I’m not able to post or make comments on world now, so figured I’d see what y’alls opinion on the matter is.
I think you shouldn’t assume everyone on the internet to be a man. It is misogynistic. I don’t think there would be anything wrong with e.g. referring gender neutrally to someone who turns out to be a woman because you didn’t check her profile which says she’s a woman, but it is annoying to see people assume everyone on the internet to be male. I’ve especially experienced this in more techy communities which definitely seems like sexist stereotyping to me.
You weren’t misgendering; you were meming. Modifying one part of “the man, the myth, the X” to adapt it to the situation is fine and good, but when you start swapping out too much of it (“the X, the myth, the Y” – or worse, “the X, the Y, the Z”) you lose the reference.
Yeah that’s my thought. It’s an expression. I’ve said things like “c’mon man” to people IRL I know to be women, without complaint. If I was using the word “man” in this kind of way and the person I was saying it to asked me not to, I would of course respect their wishes and stop doing it to them, but I’ve not seen it happen before.
But a third person coming in to whinge when the person I was talking to had no complaint? 🙄
(As a side note, with this specific expression I quite like the alternative of “the ma’am…”. That helps it scan exactly the same as the original phrase.)
Doesn’t really matter here. The saying is “the man, the myth, the legend”. If you go changing every part of it you might as well have not said anything at all because it won’t make any sense.
Agree. Some expressions become so iconic they get genderless. Just like sometimes it’s accept to use “man” and “dude” as a genderless exclamation
I once got a temporary ban on another platform for arguing/suggesting that dude has become genderless.
I know multiple woman that use “dude” that way, but some people are somewhat understandably sensitive on the topic of gender.
it depends a lot on context tbh, usually its fine but you can kinda tell when someone is calling you a dude to be an ass
Regardless of your opinion on whether dude has become genderless or not (I also use dude for my friends of any gender), the word is a gendered term that has become ubiquitous. If someone doesn’t want me to use “dude” referring to them, I won’t. It’s not good to assume, so until I know that someone doesn’t mind, I’m not going to use gendered terms contrary to their gender. I wouldn’t call a man “sis” or “girl” the same way I would women I’m friends with, unless I know that doesn’t make them uncomfortable. I wouldn’t call a woman “bro” or “guy” the same way I would men I’m friends with unless I checked. All of those terms are gender nonspecific for me, but they might make someone who doesn’t have my lived experience uncomfortable.
The Ma’am the myth the legend is right there though :D
Exactly this.
You are supposed to do deep research on the person you’re commenting to…
I barely even read usernames, plus Voyager App doesn’t show profile bios, so even if I wanted to check their profile I can’t and I’m sure as fuck not using the mobile website to get the information.
Same. Voyager doesn’t show it, I’ll do my best, but I’m not going to feel bad when I miss
That’s why I just stick with they/them, anyone who gets annoyed about me using that isn’t worth the energy, it’s an anonymous message board, I don’t know you, that’s my purse!
Dumbass here gets it!
Remember kids, moron is a genderless word that can be applied to anyone!
That’s not an excuse nor justification for misgendering anyone, neutral pronouns exist, use them.
If you tell me I will use them, I’m not a mind reader, I’m a dumbass with an internet connection.
I’m pretty apathetic to gender in general but I’ve had gender confirming surgery to be NB which I guess technically makes me trans and to be prefectly honest I’ve never felt more judged for it than by the lemmy LGBTQ+ community. The 50y/o southern man that was my nursing supervisor back when I was a new graduate was more respectful of my gender and lived experiences than these people. Honestly the thing they seem to hate most is specifically me expressing apathy for gender; I’ve mentioned that my transness expresses itself by not caring about the whole pronoun thing or needing to have any specific pronouns for myself personally, but that I understand it’s a matter of respect for others and I’ve literally gotten banned for saying that. Like almost exactly that. They’re absolutely hateful bastards for no reason other than that they’re upset and need everybody else to be upset too. I’m lucky I have a handful of supportive people irl because I sure asf wasn’t gonna find it here!
Going to dig through your comment history later, im curious to see what has been said o.o reminds me of the greentext of the black guy telling a story at a party of all white people, and he says the N word and a white girl asks him to not say that as it makes her uncomfortable and the black dude mentally is like “??? Are you fr?..”
Telling people not to do something when it makes you uncomfortable, for sure, that’s adulting 101. Hoooowever… Feel that shows how much social interaction that gal has actually had with African Americans outside of a professional setting… not much :|
It probably doesn’t help that I’m incredibly irreverent of pretty much everything. I got really into western esoteric spirituality this past year (its really been helping me with introspection and integrating my personality in ways that neither secular therapy or my fundie upbringing ever quite fully did on their own) but at the same time I refuse to take any religion seriously, especially not my own.
Anyway someone in a related community got upset at me for having my irreverent attitude because I was “culturally appropriating” tarot cards from PoC and like dude. Look up where that shit is from its Northern Italy where my family is from just two generations ago they were fresh off the boat when the War was starting. You’re appropriating tarot from me. And if you want to get into the specific spiritual / divinatory usage that’s even fucking whiter. The closest you’re gonna get to claiming cultural appropriation is if you go all the way back before the tarot to the mummy dust the hermetic order of the golden dawn were probably mixing into the coke they were snorting while making that shit the fuck up based on their judeo-christian / classical mythology crossover fanfiction.
People just wanna be mad about shit and at this point I really don’t have the energy to spend appeasing people who have already decided to be mad at me. Imma just be over here using these cards to let my subconscious tell me which level of Maslow’s hierarchy of needs I fucked up this week.
If you don’t mind answering, what sort of surgery did you get for a NB transition?
Removal of gendered aspects without any additions.
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Drag agrees, Lemmy is very cruel to trans people. Drag gets so many people yelling at drag for using drag’s first person neopronouns. So many people insisting drag’s pronouns are third person and making it into an argument.
Drag threw me for a loop the first time drag replied to me. I assumed it was a bit at first because this is the Internet and all, but I looked at drag’s history to see what the story was, since it’s not like anyone gives an introduction before commenting.
Other than the pronouns, Drag’s posts are like anyone else’s. Nothing was trollish, and Drag has explained drag’s pronouns a few times. It’s interesting to see drag’s idea is to create something simpler, but as it is not very English in structure, it sounds very strange at first. I think I’ve gotten the idea now, though I have had to make a few corrections as I type this.
First, I think people should be able to be whoever they want to be, especially online, if they aren’t doing things to be jerks. Drag has not done anyone wrong that I’ve seen. So if Drag asks me to call drag by something, why wouldn’t I? Drag has engaged with me in a friendly way, so I owe drag the same.
Second, I enjoy it as a creative exercise. It keeps my mind engaged while writing what would otherwise be a bland reply. It’s kind of fun to see language experience some flexibility and evolution, and if it honestly makes Drag feel better about drag’s self, I can accommodate that. If you can’t abide that, just move on and let Drag live drag’s life.
Even though most of us are liberal here, it doesn’t mean we’re free of bias or not stuck in our own ways. Even if we don’t get something, it doesn’t hurt us to cooperate with someone that it does make sense to. That’s just my feelings though.
Just stop giving a fuck, there’s a metric shitton of crazies doing janny work, it’s unpaid and very unsatisfying. If they ban you, it’s either their instance’s loss or nobody’s. The account costs nothing because it’s worth next to nothing. I don’t even need the links that I myself post and the others’ I can see even if they ban my account. This is a shitpile, it being in the fediverse doesn’t make it less of a shitpile.
I personally try to avoid gendered language, but if I do use it, I tend to check their profile-bio :)
I know that for some people it’s quite a struggle. Whether it is their focus, lazyness, energy levels, unwillingness during their toilet time or something else.
So, I’d say no. That’s part of why I usually just go for they/them. Just like when you don’t know someone’s pronouns irl
Then there are those of us who grew up in an era where usernames either didn’t matter or didn’t exist (depending on the platform), so you quickly became conditioned to just not reading their name let alone clicking into their whole account to see who they are. I am guilty of it, but people looking at your profile is creepy.
I know that on Reddit before I left, the only time I ever took a good hard look at someone else’s account is if they said something that made me so unbelievably angry that I had to look at everything else they said to find something to clap back with. By the time I would get partway through their post history, I would realize that I let a random stranger on the internet tilt me and then I’d calm down and feel stupid for a while before going back to my own business.
We are all strangers on the internet. Let’s keep it that way.
Right, do tell me how “semperverus” or “edie” tells me anything about gender? Yes, I know my profile is empty with just some comments, feel free to be as creeped out as you like.
Looking trough your profile I can’t figure out your gender either. Just a fanatic use of slurs
That’s a pretty reasonable misunderstanding, I don’t speak for anyone but myself but generally as long as there’s no malice involved I’m not upset by an accidental misgendering.
I’m on jerboa too and didn’t even know there were specific pronouns on accounts, I just chucked mine in my bio.
I just checked the apps I use, and sync shows display names properly.
If somebody corrects you about gender, just say woops, correct yourself, and move on. It’s an honest mistake, a simple fix, and nobody should be offended. Especially online. If they are still offended, it’s because they want to be.
I think the issue here is that it wasn’t a case of “somebody corrects you about their gender”. It was “a third unrelated person comes in and rudely yells at you that you should have already known not to use a turn of phrase”.
The user’s pronouns were in her username, OP’s client just doesn’t display additional lines.
Especially since in this case it was not even the person that was misgendered that called it out. Maybe the original person doesn’t even care.
Usually when I make a mistake while trying to act in good faith, I apologize. Posting about the interaction without apology and flashing names of non-mods involved is not the way to correct your mistake, nor to garner sympathy.
I did apologize to the mod I emailed. Not looking for sympathy, frankly I was more interested from a technical perspective as to why her pronouns aren’t showing on Jerboa, but they were on the browser.
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I’m probably a bit further to the right than most on the fediverse with this opinion but…
I think, once you have been informed of someone’s pronouns, it’s flat out rude to not use them. I don’t know if it’s a banning issue but that’s for the moderators on your instance to decide or the instance the community is on. Even if you don’t agree with someone’s lifestyle, it’s just polite to address people the way they’d like to be addressed.
But surely there’s a difference between intentional misuse and accidental. I think banning someone for not looking up someone’s pronouns before a public interaction seems like pushing things a bit far here. I certainly am not checking such things. But, then in general when online I will use gender neutral wording because frankly, for online interactions someone’s rarely information that matters for the interaction. I don’t really need to know.
My view is, I think it is almost always clear when someone is being malicious and thus transphobic and when someone makes an honest mistake/did not know better. We, as a whole, really should be differentiating between obviously malicious and non-malicious cases.
Yaa that is similar to my viewpoint, though I am also a cis, white, blonde, blue eyed, tall, male, so my experiences/opinions are coming through the privilege lenses absolutely :| Having to deal with conversations like this all the time with “normies”, can imagine people who are deep into such social circles get tired of dealing with the acting-in-bad faith bullshitters.
I don’t think it’s necessary to check every profile for potential pitfalls when interacting with them. But honestly, in this case there is an obvious transgender flag in the profile name that should make you at least question your first assumption.
What percentage of the populace do you think knows what the transgender flag looks like? :|
Most of it, but that has nothing to do with you and is just a meagre deflection. The right response would have been “whoops my bad, didn’t notice that, I’ll do better next time” or a variation thereof.
Shifting the discussion as you are trying to do is just poor behaviour that makes your alleged genuine questions seem much less so. Sort of how like when I misgender someone I don’t go and make a big fuss about it, dig my heels in and try to start a discussion about morality or expectations. I correct my mistake and thank the person for informing me of it. It’s not a big deal unless you make it one, which you’ve doneis this ragebait or something
Noo, it is an honest question. I’m a digital native, been to a decent amount of gay bars, even worked as security for pride in my city this year. Have probably seen the flag, have never had it come up that “yep this is the flag for the trans community”. Outside of Hamburgerland where transgenderism has become so politicized, huge press X to doubt people know what that flag is. Most folks on the planet are Indian, Chinese, or in an Islamic country of some sort. Now do tell, dear blakeus12. How do all of those cultures treat LGBTQ+ people :| if it was a question of how many people in the US recognized the flag, different story.
What do your racist ideas of a homogenous global south with no queers have to do with this. Literally why say this.
You said it yourself in this comment. There aren’t queers there. Well, there are. They just aren’t treated very well if they’re open about it, to my knowledge. Logically, if a culture is “not there”, or in this context, being legally and culturally suppressed, I doubt there is going to be much awareness about things like which letters in LGBTQ+ corresponds to which flag. Id be happy to read something that you think would be enlightening on the subject.
To my knowledge
Your “knowledge” is years of reddit threads and a lifetime of immersion in US imperial propaganda meant to dehumanize its enemies while justifying its own endless violent interventions.
Before lgbtq rights, the excuse was spreading democracy, and before that it was “bringing civillization.” The truth is, the US doesn’t give a shit about their rights, it only cares about using them as an excuse for mass murder. They actively make life more dangerous for queer people around the world by using queerness as a human shield for their activities, same as Isreal does with jewishness, tying them together in the eyes of a casual observer, lying to its victims that “we are bombing you because you are homophobic/antisemetic and we are Jewish/queer” while it simply bombs them for their land and resources.
America does not defend queer people, it puppets them into the line of fire.
It’d be like if I kept you in a basement for 20 years, then murdered an entire neighborhood of people, then put up a billboard saying “I did this so ToucheGoodSir could have a place to live, because I love him.”
And then other people looked at that billboard and said “wow, that ShimmeringKoi sure treats his friends well.”
Shut the fuck up cracker, there’s no “reading” which can cover such vastly different regions of the world with their own queer histories. By bringing up your orientalist ideas of the global south you’re only proving your own stupidity. You clearly exist in a context in which the trans flag is common and a clear indicator to pay special regards to that user’s pronouns, and instead of just apologizing and moving on you’re making a mockery of yourself by trying to use your own racism to disguise your transphobia.
Someone got mad enough to report you for this lmaooooo
If the trans flag was common to see and commonly talked about in Hamburgerland, I imagine I would have been more aware of what it meant. You’re calling me racist… While using a racial slur?
Ok, let’s whip out some facts. Of the countries in Asia where gay marriage is legal (different from transgender folk, yes I am aware, but I think we can all agree gays are a lot more accepted these days than trans people), there are 3. Nepal, the Republic of China (Taiwan), and soon Thailand. In Africa, there’s just one, South Africa. In the middle east, just Israel (maybe that’s how they keep getting American weapon shipments, they have a lock in the US gay Mafia).
Of course, in many more Asian/African countries than the ones I listed, it isn’t ILLEGAL to have same sex intercourse*. However feel that’s a decent metric for acceptance (and, by extension, awareness) of the various LGBTQ+ life styles.
Most folks on the planet are Indian, Chinese, or in an Islamic country of some sort. Now do tell, dear blakeus12. How do all of those cultures treat LGBTQ+ people :|
China has cities bigger than New York that are pretty trans-positive. These entities aren’t monolithic in their values, and in fact I would say they are more diverse in their values for better and for worse, compared to the US. What you are referring to is a cartoon perspective on these ~dozen countries spoon fed to you by western chauvinists.
Ha, there it is, couldn’t resist propagandizing for long using the same excuse currently being used to justify the genocide of Palsetinians
Do you think the commentary on the Israelis controlling the US via their married contacts in the American gay Mafia is me propogandizing to white wash Israel?
Most folks on the planet are Indian, Chinese, or in an Islamic country of some sort. Now do tell, dear blakeus12. How do all of those cultures treat LGBTQ+ people :|
I’ve lived in at least one of the countries you’ve mentioned. LGBTQ+ people exist and live in the same capacity they do in western Europe and North America. It seems ridiculous for a westerner to try to implicate global majority countries for queerphobia when the US and UK are currently on a trans exterminatory cultural rampage. Stones in glass houses shit.
well if you didn’t know now you do and can avoid this kind of interaction again if your so worried about it
The online percentage.
65% is my guess.
Globally? Dawg… how many countries in Asia and Africa is gay marriage even legal in, let alone some semblance and awareness of transgenderism.
Not globally, but on lemmy. I assumed that’s what you meant.
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Always has been
