This is a genuine question because your comment got me thinking: does Russia even have just-cause to attack Europe (jus ad bellum)? I’m worried that if they attacked now that there wouldn’t be enough reason to do so and then it would escalate even further.
Under the rules of war, Russia has a right to strike targets where weapons are being manufactured for use against them, and where recruits are trained for use against them. There are also facilities that are operated by Western military personel, in Poland and in Western Ukraine, which relay satellite reconaissance information to the Ukrainians so they can make strikes with drones and Western missiles. Those facilities and satellites are also legitimate targets.
These are the same justifications that the US was using for drone striking Pakistan, Iran and other neighbouring countries while occupying Iraq and Afghanistan.
The fact that the Russians have been so patient and reluctant to strike at these targets shows how serious they take the danger of nuclear war. But the West keeps doing what it’s doing because they like to pretend that this way, they don’t seem to be at war with Russia, and they don’t stop, because they think Russia is bluffing when.
Thank you for the explanation, this makes sense. So under international law Russia does have just cause to attack countries who are supplying Ukraine with weapons and intelligence, thats interesting because I have a feeling that if Russia did do that then the international judicial system would throw a fit…
Yeah. They just called a meeting at the UN to discuss Western countries helping Ukraine to strike Russia’s territory. I suspect they’ll start taking action after that.
A country has a casus belli to attack anywhere where weapons used against them are produced or shipped from, where intel and surveillance against used in the war against them are conducted from, and where soldiers who fight against them are trained. Thus according to the laws of war Russia has every right to strike not only Europe but the US too.
Whether a country also has the means to do this in practice is another matter. In Russia’s case they most certainly do, but so far they have chosen not to.
So in international law, Russia has every right to strike a good chunk of European countries + the US and Canada, but a problem I have with that is would they even be allowed to? Considering how much international law is catered to the West, even though Russia has just cause to strike outside of Ukraine, would the Judicial system really let it slide? Russia has been labeled the villain and I don’t know if any amount of legal justifications will let them do what they can, if that makes sense.
The Europeans have played party to overthrowing the neighboring neutral government to install and arm a bunch of Nazis on their doorstep- and to make matters worse, alongside the asset seizures and constant provocative language (as an understatement) by various Euro officials, there’s incredibly good reason to believe that various European states have:
played a role in the targeting and guidance of missile/drone attacks, including on Russian soil- not only in regards to providing intelligence and training at that, but in their mercenaries, ““mercenaries,”” foreign legions, and various other agents directly targeting Russian troops and territory
supported, if not potentially outright engaged in facilitating a deadly terror attack on Russian civilians (as well as a campaign of assassinations)
the Nordics are likely implicated in the Nordstream bombing (working alongside the US, of course) if Seymour Hersh’s report is to be believed- which it should be
Frankly, if Russia or any other country had done any of the above to the west, they would have gone in guns blazing and baying for blood indiscriminately. The Afghans didn’t even aid in 9/11 and offered up al-Qaeda (who were a pain in their ass anyways) and we all know what happened.
If you ask me, Russia has more reasonable, justifiable casus belli than the west has ever had throughout all of their constant warmongering in almost 100 years- since the last world war, in fact.
Every time I see your comments they are always so detailed, it’s great.
With all of this, Russia has more than enough reason to strike back, but they’re very clearly holding back and I do not fault that decision. I can’t begin to understand their motives for staying within Ukraine, but for me I would hesitate striking anyone else because, even though international law gives them that right, I don’t believe the global judicial system will let that slide. Russia is public enemy number one and any attack they do is already seen as unjustified, so if they went after let’s say France, people would go fucking insane because everything Russia does is inherently bad, no matter how much legal justification they have.
Thanks! I’ve enjoyed your comments and seeing you around the 'grad as well :)
I agree also, if I were Russia, I wouldn’t be taking the fight outside Ukraine (yet), save for what they are already doing (aiding the various west African states breaking free from France, low-key assistance with the MENA resistance, etc…
It wouldn’t be out of any care for the western public opinion, though, FWIW. The so-called “global judicial system” (ie. western-dominated institutions that are increasingly being called into question by the majority of the world as the western double standards are being exposed in front of genocide for what they are) and “international community” doesn’t matter one bit in this regard.
Russia’s real audience, the ones whose opinions are actually worth a damn- the actual international community, the global majority- would be the real concern. That, and managing the situation in such a way that both avoids unnecessary escalation while ensuring Russia’s interests are preserved (and letting the west dig its own grave and then some), of course.
For what it’s worth, on the former- I think the rest of the world outside of the west (and even many in the west at this point) see the western farce, and constant fascist antagonisms for what they are. I’d even question if anyone (whose opinion matters) would cry overly much if at all, if Russia decided to give France a proper spanking and humbling. The Russian approach this far has already made it clear without a doubt, for anyone capable of seeing it (anyone who doesn’t frankly may as well be considered a lost cause, a terminal kind of colonized/colonial mindset) that Russia has done everything possible, save for commiting the equivalent of national suicide, to avoid and de-escalate this conflict.
This is a genuine question because your comment got me thinking: does Russia even have just-cause to attack Europe (jus ad bellum)? I’m worried that if they attacked now that there wouldn’t be enough reason to do so and then it would escalate even further.
Under the rules of war, Russia has a right to strike targets where weapons are being manufactured for use against them, and where recruits are trained for use against them. There are also facilities that are operated by Western military personel, in Poland and in Western Ukraine, which relay satellite reconaissance information to the Ukrainians so they can make strikes with drones and Western missiles. Those facilities and satellites are also legitimate targets.
These are the same justifications that the US was using for drone striking Pakistan, Iran and other neighbouring countries while occupying Iraq and Afghanistan.
The fact that the Russians have been so patient and reluctant to strike at these targets shows how serious they take the danger of nuclear war. But the West keeps doing what it’s doing because they like to pretend that this way, they don’t seem to be at war with Russia, and they don’t stop, because they think Russia is bluffing when.
Thank you for the explanation, this makes sense. So under international law Russia does have just cause to attack countries who are supplying Ukraine with weapons and intelligence, thats interesting because I have a feeling that if Russia did do that then the international judicial system would throw a fit…
Yeah. They just called a meeting at the UN to discuss Western countries helping Ukraine to strike Russia’s territory. I suspect they’ll start taking action after that.
A country has a casus belli to attack anywhere where weapons used against them are produced or shipped from, where intel and surveillance against used in the war against them are conducted from, and where soldiers who fight against them are trained. Thus according to the laws of war Russia has every right to strike not only Europe but the US too.
Whether a country also has the means to do this in practice is another matter. In Russia’s case they most certainly do, but so far they have chosen not to.
So in international law, Russia has every right to strike a good chunk of European countries + the US and Canada, but a problem I have with that is would they even be allowed to? Considering how much international law is catered to the West, even though Russia has just cause to strike outside of Ukraine, would the Judicial system really let it slide? Russia has been labeled the villain and I don’t know if any amount of legal justifications will let them do what they can, if that makes sense.
They have a decent reason to do so, but that doesn’t preclude escalation.
The Europeans have played party to overthrowing the neighboring neutral government to install and arm a bunch of Nazis on their doorstep- and to make matters worse, alongside the asset seizures and constant provocative language (as an understatement) by various Euro officials, there’s incredibly good reason to believe that various European states have:
played a role in the targeting and guidance of missile/drone attacks, including on Russian soil- not only in regards to providing intelligence and training at that, but in their mercenaries, ““mercenaries,”” foreign legions, and various other agents directly targeting Russian troops and territory
supported, if not potentially outright engaged in facilitating a deadly terror attack on Russian civilians (as well as a campaign of assassinations)
the Nordics are likely implicated in the Nordstream bombing (working alongside the US, of course) if Seymour Hersh’s report is to be believed- which it should be
Frankly, if Russia or any other country had done any of the above to the west, they would have gone in guns blazing and baying for blood indiscriminately. The Afghans didn’t even aid in 9/11 and offered up al-Qaeda (who were a pain in their ass anyways) and we all know what happened.
If you ask me, Russia has more reasonable, justifiable casus belli than the west has ever had throughout all of their constant warmongering in almost 100 years- since the last world war, in fact.
Every time I see your comments they are always so detailed, it’s great.
With all of this, Russia has more than enough reason to strike back, but they’re very clearly holding back and I do not fault that decision. I can’t begin to understand their motives for staying within Ukraine, but for me I would hesitate striking anyone else because, even though international law gives them that right, I don’t believe the global judicial system will let that slide. Russia is public enemy number one and any attack they do is already seen as unjustified, so if they went after let’s say France, people would go fucking insane because everything Russia does is inherently bad, no matter how much legal justification they have.
Thanks! I’ve enjoyed your comments and seeing you around the 'grad as well :)
I agree also, if I were Russia, I wouldn’t be taking the fight outside Ukraine (yet), save for what they are already doing (aiding the various west African states breaking free from France, low-key assistance with the MENA resistance, etc…
It wouldn’t be out of any care for the western public opinion, though, FWIW. The so-called “global judicial system” (ie. western-dominated institutions that are increasingly being called into question by the majority of the world as the western double standards are being exposed in front of genocide for what they are) and “international community” doesn’t matter one bit in this regard.
Russia’s real audience, the ones whose opinions are actually worth a damn- the actual international community, the global majority- would be the real concern. That, and managing the situation in such a way that both avoids unnecessary escalation while ensuring Russia’s interests are preserved (and letting the west dig its own grave and then some), of course.
For what it’s worth, on the former- I think the rest of the world outside of the west (and even many in the west at this point) see the western farce, and constant fascist antagonisms for what they are. I’d even question if anyone (whose opinion matters) would cry overly much if at all, if Russia decided to give France a proper spanking and humbling. The Russian approach this far has already made it clear without a doubt, for anyone capable of seeing it (anyone who doesn’t frankly may as well be considered a lost cause, a terminal kind of colonized/colonial mindset) that Russia has done everything possible, save for commiting the equivalent of national suicide, to avoid and de-escalate this conflict.