This isn’t bitching so much as a curiosity. Here in Lemmy.ml, would it be considered abusive for an admin to actively participate in a discussion, then get upset and delete the same comments they themselves have been replying to?
I’d just like to clarify the administration posture of this instance. There are lots of accusations of unfairness here. I don’t know if that’s an individualistic thing or a matter of policy.
Mainly asking so I can more easily identify what discussions are not safe to participate in.
Cheers!
What
Would you like me to take an audio recording for you, or?
What
👌 thanks for your contribution to the discussion
What discussion lol. You’re complaining about moderators moderating.
I’m questioning the optics and impact of moderators/admins participating in discussions while removing opinions counter to theirs, sometimes under false pretenses. If you want free and open discussion, that’s not how you want an instance to operate, it’s just another form of authoritarianism and censorship in its own right.
You still haven’t shown any examples of these removed comments not whether or not they were breaking instance rules.
This post specifically is what made me think about it
But that same admin has a history of posting highly questionable information and deleting anyone who disagrees.
asks for example
provides example
reports comment
What
It’s perfectly valid - moderators are both moderators and users.
When someone posts a questionable comment, it’s perfectly fine to press them on it, and see if there was a misunderstanding. If a short conversation reveals, no, actually they were just a dick, yeah, delete that whole thread. Nuke them into orbit
I agree with that perspective but don’t believe that’s what’s happening. From what I’ve seen it is very heavily politically motivated.
Being a reactionary is a type of being a dick and their posts should be removed
That’s what’s interesting, “reactionary” has started to lose its meaning and more turned into “reacting with an opinion I disagree with”
But that’s where the conflict of interest comes in. Any discussion is inherently imbalanced when half of it is blanket removed- but it’s okay as long as it’s the other
If you want free speech absolutism, feel free to find instances that cater to that. Nobody is asking you to participate on here. Your opinions are simply not welcome because people find them trite and tiring.
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Idk if it’s actually a lemmy.ml thing or what, but coming from lemmy.world, every time I see a post from .ml, like half of the comments have been deleted by moderator(s). In general, .ml seems to have really heavy handed censorship and it gives me a really bad perception of .ml overall.
I agree there. Then you look at the mod log and it’s stuff like “Hamas is bad” or “Stalin wasn’t so great” Or “China is pretty capitalist”
Then you look through the mod log and something like 50% or more of removed comments are all from .ml
Definitely wouldn’t make it my home instance
This is the post that made me think about it
Compare the deleted comments to the mod log and it’s just like… wuht?
And every single post in the thread was deleted by the same guy, who just drops the same post with a ton of links to questionable sources to every comment before deleting them.
https://lemmy.world/comment/10157921
Yeah my post there got removed and in my inbox it was cited as ‘Spam,’ even though I was commenting on how that post had (as I said previously) most of the comments removed by moderator(s).
Tbh .ml is feeling less and less hospitable every time I interact with the instance, which sucks cause when reddit fell, .ml was my go-to. I don’t even want to use my .ml account anymore on principle.
Yeah it’s unfortunate
And now I’ve been shadowbanned. I can’t vote on topics there anymore. I know which user it is too, since there’s only 2 mods and one hasn’t done anything in 3yrs. Hint: it’s OP of the post. Is there a way to report unfavorably run communities to the .ml server owners?
I mean, it’s davel. I can see it in the mod logs.
How is that shown in the mod logs?
Must be because I’m on Voyager then. I can’t find a way to access mod logs through the app.
Now they’ve removed my comment that was calling them out, and I didn’t even get a message on why (like I don’t anyway know the answer is ‘mod abuse’).
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I mean look for yourself. It’s right there.
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it looks like OP was posting CIA propaganda. Here are some resources:
Actual footage from Tiananmen square as covered by the CPC
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g8dqOuHqcBQ
https://youtu.be/7bl_cyYHwNQ
Explanation of what happened https://worldaffairs.blog/2019/06/02/tiananmen-square-massacre-facts-fiction-and-propaganda/Translation of official government explanation
https://www.mango-press.com/report-on-stopping-unrest-and-quelling-counter-revolutionary-riots/Tankman full vid
https://youtu.be/GRb4VY2dU4cSo your assertion is that Tiananmen square didn’t happen, and the OP was banned for saying that it did happen?
Edit: does anybody else find it suspicious that this comment is this account’s only one?
Dude just read the resources and watch the videos. This isn’t a debate.
You injected discussions about Tiananmen Square into this debate. It came out of nowhere.
And I simply don’t accept the official Chinese picture of what happened. There is plenty of evidence of what happened.
What I do accept is the nuance. But you’d have to read the rest of my responses to understand that.
Huh? The point is not to accept a single source as authorative. If you watched the videos you’d realize the western account is a complete fabrication. You obvious didn’t look at them at all.
Examine ALL evidence from the event. Testimony from the Chilean embassador who was nearby at the time. All videos, photo, WikiLeaks diplomatic cables.
I don’t think you’re here on good faith as you seem to have no intellectual curiosity. I was SHOCKED when I saw the full tank man video and the footage of moloktov cocktails being thrown.
get back to reddit glowie
I don’t know what a “glowie” is.
I don’t much care for Reddit, thanks.
Edit: you almost got my with your misdirection and muddying of the waters. Fair play.
But seriously, do I understand the original post I replied to correctly? They’re saying that the OP was banned for asserting that there was a massacre in Tiananmen Square, and then presents evidence that it didn’t actually happen?
The OP was correctly banned for spreading misinformation.
The OP was supposedly banned for spreading information that supports that an event happened (The Tiananmen Square massacre), which is something that one of the most repressive media regimes that exists in the world (China) is trying to deny.
That sounds like the use of moderation powers in support of another government’s propaganda.
I just wish .ml would be more open about whose government propaganda is allowed, I guess, which echoes OP’s question.
Is it all of .ml where only Chinese propaganda is allowed, but US is not? Russian disinformation is ok, but not English? What are the lines, assuming I am interested in taking part in discourse on .ml?
Except that the event didn’t happen, there was no massacre in the Tiananmen Square. And the event that did happen in actuality is wildly different from the propaganda you’re regurgitating. Also, have no idea why you feel the need to sealion into discussions on .ml when it’s clearly that you fundamentally disagree with the views majority of people here hold.
It’s highly suspicious yes, lol
Also not what I posted
I also wasn’t banned so… idk.
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You’re constantly insulting people. That’s why your comments keep getting removed: you’re just being an asshole, not actually having any discussions.
How did anything he just said directly insult you?
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… the most recent time you’ve had your comments removed was because you were calling people children and fascists, without engaging substantively at all?
And my comments, which insulted you in kind, were also removed. So you’re just wrong.
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You’re being ignorant of your own actions.
If you want to have conversations with people who aren’t exactly like you then you need to soften your approach.
You just calling people children if they do lot accept your binary worldview is not engaging with people. And many of them were k. Fact trying to engage with you. You’ll notice that their comments were not removed.
You’ll also notice that you and I were among the only to have our comments removed. It’s because you were the only person to report to the mods. And then I did the same when the mod clearly had no interest in actually reading your behavior, so I reported your insults in kind to the moderation team.
You literally started the escalation to moderation because you couldn’t take me insulting you, so you reported it.
I am of the mind that dissenting and even occasionally mean spirited discourse is good. It’s why I thought lemmy would be an improvement over other online spaces, which is generally true except for .ml, where if I try to inject any nuance to international relations I am simply called a “liberal.”
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We are all quaking in our boots.
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Yes, this is definitely on brand for them. Not only that, but they will then follow you around the fediverse and ban you for comments you make in other instances.
As the thread you posted clearly indicates, discussion on certain topics is outright banned.
.ml is widely considered a joke on the fediverse, filled with overly sensitive tankies who like to antagonize people and then ban them if they push back even mildly.
I mean credit where credit is due, this post is still up, and they’ve got good memes
I’ve been part of moderating a subreddit that has a loose conflict of interest policy, so I’ll throw in my two cents. Our policy is to avoid commenting and moderating in the same thread. There are some exceptions, like with particularly egregious violations. But even then, replying to the comment, deleting it, then banning the user would be considered an abuse of power. Instead, the common practice is to just report it for other moderators without a CoI to deal with.
I consider a conflict of interest policy to be as much about protecting the community itself as anything. Many online communities have run into trouble when someone with elevated permissions like a moderator is even perceived as having abused their powers. Community splits or failures have happened over even just one moderator “power tripping.” That’s why it’s necessary for moderators to put some restraints on themselves to maintain community trust.
The post that inspired this one had upward of 15 people given a site ban in a post with 80 comments. Several of those had a reply from the banning admin. The bans themselves may have been justified, but the optics are terrible. That’s exactly the sort of thing that has a history of eroding community trust. Even for people who have the aim of an instance for Marxist-Leninist thought, there are going to be schisms. Setting boundaries is necessary to preempt problems.
You’re making an accusation without providing any evidence of the supposed abuses or unfairness. Why do you feel the need to spread FUD?
Just wear the badge you’ve earned and stfu
happy seething and coping to you kiddo
Depends on the comment. You can both address the issues of a comment and remove it if it breaks the rules.
My own experience was having a full, hours long debate with a mod, who after I didn’t just accept their world view simply deleted all my comments and banned me. They left their own comments and arguments of course.
In the kiddo’s it just says “rule 2” as explanation for my ban and the deleted comments, but “rule 2” was about NSFW posts. Our conversation was about whether mediabiasfactcheck can be used as a tool to assess news sources. I kept it respectful. Nothing at all NSFW about it.
I’d have to see what actually happened, I can’t just take your word for it at face-value.
It would be in the mod log at worldnews, about four weeks ago. Since I couldn’t participate there I blocked the sub (before understood how lemmy worked), so I unfortunately cannot screenshot the exact comments. But it shouldn’t take a lot of effort if you’re actually interested.
I am shocked just SHOCKED that a .ml admin would use such tactics. It isn’t hinted at at all by the community or it’s behavior (LMAO /s).
Seriously, using mod powers to manipulate the conversation is a tankies wet dream. This isn’t surprising or even unexpected.
Are the tankies in the room with your right now child?
I was also banned and had all my comments removed after having a long debate with a mod on the world news sub. When I did not accept their viewpoint, they eventually nuked everything and just banned me.
And the debate was all about whether government propaganda news sources were good sources of media. I was asserting that they weren’t and that you should be able to use whatever tools exist to assess them for bias.
But they really don’t like it when you undermine their sources of information.
It’s inevitably an alienating shit show whenever I have to interact with users from .ml, since they go out and pollute other instances.
In fact, if you look at the history of many of the users in this thread who are upvoted for insulting you, you can see them polluting and insulting their way all over the place.
I like being on an instance where trolls get banned. It was a fun hobby to check in during reddit exodus, see some garbage comments and guess how long it’d take for it to be banned. The internet is full of freeze-peach reactionary havens. Lemmy.ml is luckily not one of them
