This is a weird one. Bear with me. From !dataisbeautiful@lemmygrad.ml:
So I said to myself, “that’s a little bit weird. The US one going up, I can actually believe, but the North Korea one being lower is definitely wrong.”
I think Our World In Data is just being shoddy, as they often do.
https://www.wfp.org/countries/democratic-peoples-republic-korea
The thing I found funny, and why I’m posting here, comes from observing why it was that they started their graph at 2003 and exactly at 2003.
I feel like you could use this as a slide in a little seminar in “how to curate your data until it matches your conclusion, instead of the other way around.”
And also, I don’t think the hunger rate suddenly dropped from epic to 0 exactly in 2003, I think more likely Our World in Data is just a little bit shoddy about their data.
It is probably based on numbers from the North Korean government
I can’t believe you would doubt the reliable reporting of the People’s Divine Monarchy of North Korea
CIA propaganda, the poverty rate in the DPRK is -1%, and party approval rate is 102%
Source: from the DPRK, of course! Lying is illegal in glorious DRPK!
In my experience, it’s more akin to:
Source: Literally anything! That isn’t corrupt and Western!
“Like what?”
Source: Anything!
“Can I use Al Jazeera? Or Wikipedia? Or can you give me a few sources that I can look at?”
Source: No, those are corrupt and Western! You’re lying! Look at this UN report!
“This UN report says the opposite of what you said.”
Source: That’s because the UN is corrupt, and lying! And Western!
“Can you just tell me where you got this information in the first place? Even if it’s not ‘reliable’ per se, surely someone told it to you in the first place. Who was that? Where do you get your news?”
Source: Shut up! You’re sealioning! You’re being bad! You’re lying! Blocked. Cry some more!
Most of their arguments in conversations rely on strawmanning anyway, so it’s expected they don’t want you to look up any source except ones that agree with them. Especially ““NATOpedia”” 🙄 but this obscure ML post written 6 years ago on a niche forum is a completely valid source!
And everything needs to be “contextualized.” Meaning, they can decide what your sources actually mean, even if it’s something different than what they say.
“Can I do that to your sources too?”
“Don’t be ridiculous. I don’t even have sources. Are you sealioning again?”
Obviously you gonna look at the news from a blogpost! Thats the only reliable news source!
Someone told me a few days ago that Israel was striking Syria with nuclear weaponry, and the only reason I didn’t know about it was that I only consumed Western news sources.
They sent me an article that proved it! And a video of the explosion. Okay. I stopped talking with them shortly after that, after they said “Thank you for taking the bait. We’ve now come full circle,” without explaining what they meant by that.
Why has it gone up so much in the US?
They’re abusing a chart which is supposed to be configured more like this:
I think the increase in the US is probably real, maybe increasing desperation as the combination of the financial crash, opioid epidemic, and increasing rents drove people increasingly into the margins. But the size of the problem in the US is still basically 0 as in other functioning countries. I don’t know for sure, but I think if accurate numbers for North Korea were on that chart, they’d be way up above South Sudan and Madagascar. At least there are aid agencies trying to do something in Africa. In North Korea, people are just dying, and that’s it.
This article talks about the global famine relief effort for North Korea in 2002 that included monitoring so food actually went to people.
https://asiasociety.org/famine-north-korea
So yes, I believe it could have gone from epic to 0 in one year because most of the developed world came together and shipped food to North Korea.
And it’s still shameful that it’s increasing in the US.
Of course, not the NK lying.
You fell for their propaganda.
The propaganda is that they asked for food, the developed world sent it with monitors to ensure it went to people and then they said it helped?
Bruh, I had someone told me that “China lifted millions of people out of poverty”
Me, whose family emigrated out of China for both economic and political reasons: “Uh-huh, interesting…” 🤭 “Kinda odd so many people want to go to foreign countries, but few of those foreign countries’ Citizens want to immigrate to China… I wonder why…” 🙈
They did lift millions of people out of poverty, provided those people qualify to live in a T1 city.
They did. My parents had better lives in the few years before they left, compared to when they were a kid during the Mao era. Still was not a great life, and thats why they took me and my brother and we all left.
People defend a dictatorship and say “Quality of Lifr improved”. Well I mean, yea, thats to be expected as time goes on, improvent in quality of life is a global trend in (almost) every country, whether Democratic or Authoritarian, Capitalist or “Socialist”. Its not the “Socialism” that made China better, it was the diplomacy that opened up international trade. It was the better leadership after Mao. Mao didn’t do shit for China, Deng Xiaoping was who really opened up China and improved people’s lives (not saying Deng Xiaoping was a saint or anything, just stating facts). The “Socialism with Chinese Characteristics” was just his excuse, since he cant just be brutally honest and call it what it is, Capitalism (with tighter state control).
Not being poor, does not mean you are rich. China lifted millions out of poverty to what is global average. Obviously migrants prefer to go to the actually rich parts of the world.
it’s still kinda low overall (just look at steam’s regional pricings), but you were probably above the poverty line, especially if you managed to emigrate. and if you’re checking population under the UN poverty line, the statistic does hold up. that just means more people survive, not that more people self-actualize.
you were probably above the poverty line, especially if you managed to emigrate
Family based immigration to USA, had to wait like 13+ years, paperworks started wayy before I was born. As far as I know, it has nothing to do with how rich you are (well, beside the fact that the relative in the US has to sign a paper to “sponsor” us, basically promising to pay the government in case we took certain government benefits within 5 years of entering, which we we never took any of those government benefits btw). Basically its nust luck.
Edit: Also, I heard that many people, particulary people from Fujian, China, have immigrated to the US without permission. Like, they didn’t even get legal permission and could get deported at any time, yet they still came here. Like that’s how much people wanted to leave.
Which just think about it, I seemed kinda lucky tbh, most people can’t through the legal method, and is at risk of deportation come 2025 (ya know… new administration… honestly I’m not sure if legal immigrants like me are safe… 😖 hopefully, my citizenship status is good enough to not get kicked out.)
Yeah, I’ve seen that. They love to post up graphs of life expectancy, income, etc, and show it going up and up after the revolutions. It kind of loses its steam when you put those graphs next to the graphs of life expectancy, income, etc, worldwide, during that same time period, and they all go up together as a more or less unified grouping as agriculture and medicine improved and the technology boosted up the whole world.
A lack of world wide wars was also helpfull
Lemmygrad is hilarious, you fell for propaganda
The astroturf bots are really trying to manufacture consent for more direct conflict with DPRK, after the Yoon/US false flag & coup attempt fell apart.
If you’re not reading this guy’s profile, you’re missing out. Search for “radiation.”
I like how this guy acts like his crazy beliefs are just obvious information everyone should know
And read Philip’s comments pretending not to know there’s a coordinated western attack across the globe, while he’s in the middle of post after post promoting the western narrative to manufacture consent for it.
Do you have to work out of Eglin AFB for this gig, or do they let you work from home?
So you recognize your colleague from the other side huh?
